Wednesday, August 2, 2023

Better Call Saul, Don


Donald Trump has been INDICTED on FOUR CRIMINAL COUNTS for his 2020 election interference.

Besides the terrorized legislators and their staff, the victims of his crimes are the police officers, the United States of America and the 81,283,361 American voters whose right to their majority vote was conspired against by Trump’s attempt to “oppress, threaten, or intimidate” their right.

Here are the laws Trump violated in his attempt to overturn our election:


Count 1: 18 U.S.C. § 371 (Conspiracy to Defraud the United States)

If two or more persons conspire either to commit any offense against the United States, or to defraud the United States, or any agency thereof in any manner or for any purpose, and one or more of such persons do any act to effect the object of the conspiracy, each shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than five years, or both.

The general conspiracy statute, 18 U.S.C. § 371, creates an offense "[i]f two or more persons conspire either to commit any offense against the United States, or to defraud the United States, or any agency thereof in any manner or for any purpose. (emphasis added). See Project, Tenth Annual Survey of White Collar Crime, 32 Am. Crim. L. Rev. 137, 379-406 (1995)(generally discussing § 371).

The operative language is the so-called "defraud clause," that prohibits conspiracies to defraud the United States. This clause creates a separate offense from the "offense clause" in Section 371. Both offenses require the traditional elements of Section 371 conspiracy, including an illegal agreement, criminal intent, and proof of an overt act.

Hass, 216 U.S. at 479-480. In Hammerschmidt, Chief Justice Taft, defined "defraud" as follows:

To conspire to defraud the United States means primarily to cheat the Government out of property or money, but it also means to interfere with or obstruct one of its lawful governmental functions by deceit, craft or trickery, or at least by means that are dishonest. It is not necessary that the Government shall be subjected to property or pecuniary loss by the fraud, but only that its legitimate official action and purpose shall be defeated by misrepresentation, chicane or the overreaching of those charged with carrying out the governmental intention.


Count 2: 18 U.S. C. § 1512(k) (Conspiracy to Obstruct an Official Proceeding)

(k)Whoever conspires to commit any offense under this section shall be subject to the same penalties as those prescribed for the offense the commission of which was the object of the conspiracy.


Count 3: 18 U.S.C. §§ 1512(c)(2), 2 (Obstruction of and Attempt to Obstruct an Official Proceeding)

(c)Whoever corruptly—

(1)alters, destroys, mutilates, or conceals a record, document, or other object, or attempts to do so, with the intent to impair the object’s integrity or availability for use in an official proceeding; or

(2)otherwise obstructs, influences, or impedes any official proceeding, or attempts to do so, shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than 20 years, or both.


Count 4: 18 U.S.C. § 241 (Conspiracy Against Rights)

If two or more persons conspire to injure, oppress, threaten, or intimidate any person in any State, Territory, Commonwealth, Possession, or District in the free exercise or enjoyment of any right or privilege secured to him by the Constitution or laws of the United States, or because of his having so exercised the same; or

If two or more persons go in disguise on the highway, or on the premises of another, with intent to prevent or hinder his free exercise or enjoyment of any right or privilege so secured—

They shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than ten years, or both; and if death results from the acts committed in violation of this section or if such acts include kidnapping or an attempt to kidnap, aggravated sexual abuse or an attempt to commit aggravated sexual abuse, or an attempt to kill, they shall be fined under this title or imprisoned for any term of years or for life, or both, or may be sentenced to death.


Les Carpenter said...

MTG... representative of all blockheads and melonheads that have eliminated the use of reason or commonsense in the republican house membeship. MTG could make a baboon look like a genius.

Dave Dubya said...

I think she's all that and worse. We have to remember her shoes match the shoes of one of the 1/6 bomb planters. Justice hasn't been done yet.

Shaw Kenawe said...

No one will pry MAGAs' cold death grip from Trump's corrupt person. No one. Read that indictment to see the dangerous and malevolent person they worship.

If that indictment doesn't make the scales fall from their eyes, nothing will. MAGAs will never abandon Trump.

Here's an example from Bonderenka's blog:

LLAugust 2, 2023 at 11:30 PM
"But the owner of this blog believes Mike Pence is also a liar." I think that's true. Mike Pence is more than a liar. He's a narcissistic toad.

The owner of the Geeez blog believes the same thing. Why?

Because Pence would not go along with Trump's corrupt plan to steal the 2020 election from Joe Biden. The sad truth about MAGAs is that they worship an anti-democracy, anti-Constitution thug.

It doesn't matter the mountains of evidence, facts, etc., that back that statement up, they will not be moved to see what he is.

And that's why I have very little hope for our democratic republic. We've seen enough history to know what happens to countries that go down the path of following a failed, seditious president and an accused criminal.

Dave Dubya said...

I see Ray Cranston has entered the Dark Zone over there. So I added to the thread, showing evidence that MAGAts want to kill us.

Shaw Kenawe said...

Yeah. Ray’s a frequent commenter at my blog who tries to open MAGA eyes to facts. He emailed me and told me he was going to try to get some facts posted there. Ha! Good luck, but NOTHING approaching the truth and facts will make MAGA see the light.

Look at how quickly they turned on Pence after his sworn testimony proved Trump urged him to break the law and illegally install him as POTUS!

MAGA attacked Evangelical Christian Pence for telling the truth UNDER OATH and doubled down on their worshipful allegiance to the guy who’s looking at 74+ felony counts and a credibly charged rapist.

It’s pure madness!

Dave Dubya said...

Yeah, it is futile to reason with a cult.
But that doesn't stop me from presenting facts to them. They can't say nobody told them the facts. And it supports our contention that they are willfully ignorant in their unquestioning devotion to their Foul Fuhrer.

Les Carpenter said...

That's all well and good Shaw and Dave. But i'm reminded of an old and true saying... you can lead a horse to water but you cannot make it drink.

There's that and then there's this... it's not our responsibility to educate the ignorant that choose to remain ignorant of facts, evidence, and truth.

Tell them once, maybe twice, if after three times they reman unmoved cut em loose and move on. They're hopelessly lost.

I've set a goal to entirely wean myself away from all poitical BS by 12/31/2024. There is not a damn thing i can do to impact the rampant stupidity of the gop and the MAGAt's.

Dave Dubya said...

Yup. It's a futile proposition to think anything will penetrate the cult bubble. We know rational, civil discourse is beyond their powers of thinking and communication. They've been told what to think and what to say. It's sufficient for them to respond with insult, scorn or derision instead of trying to understand and communicate with a person of a different viewpoint.

I just happen to be interested in their reactions, from a psychological perspective. The are studies in defense mechanisms and paranoid ideation. Their victimhood and projection are off the charts. Their incuriosity and absolute certainty of belief assures them the comfort of a closed mind. Loyalty and fanatic devotion to their leader unites them and confirms their identity and purpose in life.

This makes them dangerous.

Cults have fascinated me for decades, and now we have the largest and most dangerous cult, "the likes of which you've never seen".

The Trump cult has likely reached its apex. It's done growing and will recede, but not soon enough. This cult will remain a threat to our republic for years to come.

Trump is America's last warning. The next fascist despot is lurking, and he will learn from Trump's triumphs and failures.

This is why the infestation of white nationalist Trumpism needs to be defeated. Their war on democracy will not relent, so neither shall we relent in its defense.

If a single fact gets through to one of them, it's a victory for truth and democracy.

So I continue to send salvos of information in the one-in-a-million chance something slips into the bubble. And they can never claim they were never exposed to the facts.

So I keep observing the cult mentality with all its bizarre, frightened, incoherent, hysterical, paranoid, arrogant, belligerent and twisted manifestations.