Tuesday, September 15, 2020

One More Round

Maybe I’m a fool. Or maybe I’m just a stubborn SOB. Or both, more likely. 

At Unabashedly American, our old conservative buddy Darrell found some of my points to be annoying under his post on how mentally unfit and dishonest “pathological liar” Joe Biden is. He is still obsessed with the fictitious Biden crime spree in Ukraine and the ensuing treacherous impeachment. I asked what crime was committed by the Bidens. As with Hillary, no actual crime was disclosed. 

Naturally I asked him for a similarly fair and balanced assessment of the president’s honesty and fitness for office. He had once agreed with me that Trump was morally unfit for office.

Turns out, someone changed. Now Trump is merely “bombastic” and “simplistic in his speech”. There was grudging admission that he “lies a lot, but frankly despite your inflated leftist claim of 2 quadrillion documented lies by Trump, they are just that: inflated propaganda.” 

Yes, I think I see. Citing facts to call out lies is "inflated propaganda". Or are Trump's lies the "inflated propaganda? Since Darrell isn't fond of answering questions, let's just assume he's offering us "Darrell's inflated propaganda". Anyway, we learn Biden is the real "pathological liar", with his legion of loyal lying journalists who don’t work for FOX(R).

I understand it isn’t pleasant to have one’s beliefs questioned, especially for conservatives. Discussion has been strained over at Darrell’s blog, so I thought I’d publish my last response to his remarks here.



Thank you for responding. I beg your patience one more time. Instead of dismissing what I say, or summarily accusing me of lies, accusations, and name calling, you could show me facts that prove your accusations and claims. You have never supported your accusations with evidence, and your other “evidence” is always from biased Right wing sources. 

I’m going to present you a reasoned, fact based response. Delete if you must, but please read it.

The demands for justice and protests against racism and police brutality this past summer have been broad and enduring. Social unrest, vandalism, beatings, gassing, and shootings have been occurring, but not every day, and certainly not in most cases. You have rejected the evidence (93% of racial justice protests have been peaceful)I linked to, and embraced FOX(R) propaganda, showing the same old footage of burning buildings every day. You also can’t accept the fact Democrats and progressives, and yes, even the BLM organization, are aligned with most Americans in condemning the destruction and violence as well as the racism and police brutality. Now Trump is fanning fears of “low income housing” in suburbs. We know what the code words mean.

“Michael Brown tried to take the gun away from an officer in Missouri, got himself shot, and thus provoked the unrighteous anger of the BLM movement to destroy Ferguson, Missouri.” Ferguson is still there. Yes, Brown was aggressive, and was then unnecessarily killed while unarmed. Unfortunately the “Hands up, don’t shoot” meme got ahead of the facts.

The deeper problem was the systemic racism in the Ferguson Police Department.

The abuses of the Ferguson Police Department were investigated by the Dept. of Justice:

“The City’s emphasis on revenue generation has a profound effect on FPD’s approach to law enforcement... This culture within FPD influences officer activities in all areas of policing, beyond just ticketing. Officers expect and demand compliance even when they lack legal authority. They are inclined to interpret the exercise of free-speech rights as unlawful disobedience, innocent movements as physical threats, indications of mental or physical illness as belligerence. Police supervisors and leadership do too little to ensure that officers act in accordance with law and policy, and rarely respond meaningfully to civilian complaints of officer misconduct. The result is a pattern of stops without reasonable suspicion and arrests without probable cause in violation of the Fourth Amendment; infringement on free expression, as well as retaliation for protected 3 expression, in violation of the First Amendment; and excessive force in violation of the Fourth Amendment.

Ferguson’s approach to law enforcement both reflects and reinforces racial bias, including stereotyping. The harms of Ferguson’s police and court practices are borne disproportionately by African Americans, and there is evidence that this is due in part to intentional discrimination on the basis of race.”

It has become abundantly clear that many more law enforcement agencies share this shameful racist and abusive pattern. There are far too many unqualified racist cops. Period.

“The antifa-fascists...” No, they are anti-fascist... “have long been looking for an excuse to riot.” NO. They are not an organized group with an agenda. They do confront white nationalists like Proud Boys. Yes, some have vandalized. Right wing groups also called for vandalism and agitation. Numbers of them were arrested. Vigilante militia nuts brought weapons to kill and escalate threats and violence.

“You have also claimed the violence is not done by the saintly antifa crowd or the pure BLM participants.” NO. I have said violence was done by thugs on both sides. You assign guilt by association, or deny the reality of peaceful protesters. I have shown they are the majority.

“It is always the fault of racist and abusive cops.” NO, I never said that. But they lit the fuse and continue their abuses.

“I don’t excuse the illegal actions on either side and think any violator of the laws should be held accountable.” I’ve agreed with this all along, yet you still misrepresent me.

“You, however, do support the Marxist and often racist BLM organization.” I have told you I support their protesting racism and police brutality. YOU imagine that means supporting Marxism and racism. The US supported Stalin, not Stalinism, to defeat Hitler.

“I guess your racism is okay because it is politically correct and approved, right?” Here we go again.  And what racism would that be? (Why does the far Right insist that opposing racism is “racism”, and opposing fascism is “fascism”? And you wonder why I say racism isn’t racism to racists...)

In case you missed my point, “Prager U” is a joke, saying Black Lives Matter is "the most racist organization in the country outside of the Ku Klux Klan".

It is the same indoctrination that the Right projects on higher education. It has gotten to the point the Right denies science.

“If they (QAnon) are bad people, then I will agree with you.” Trump refused to denounce them. Short version. Pizzagate. Hillary’s “pedophile ring”. Right wing nut with a gun threatens pizza place. Convicted criminal and Trump crony Flynn swears oath to QAnon. Got it? Perhaps this is why you still won’t acknowledge convicted criminal and Trump crony Roger Stone flashing the white power sign with Proud Boys?

“Sadly the US has its share of authoritarian terrorists who kill out of bigotry and extremism.” ~ Dubya

“Yep, including a lot of anarchists, antifa-pajama boys, and BLM organization types.” You have not given any numbers of victims killed by “anarchists, antifa-pajama boys, and BLM organization types”. Your numbers will probably not even match the Charleston church massacre, let alone the El Paso massacre and OK City bombing. Not to mention the long history of Klan and other racist massacres like Greenwood in Tulsa.

I give you the two officers shot for no reason in L.A. this weekend by such a terroristic ass.” Killing cops is murder, not terrorism.

“Damn you’re batting average is horrific.”  Maybe according to a near-sighted umpire, but not according to the facts. On the other hand, you are batting zero as far as providing facts to show my errors. My wait continues.

“The House had the obligation and duty to call witnesses and subpoena evidence...”  Yes, but you offered zero facts and only opinion from “ their politically motivated articles of impeachment...”  to ......."the vast majority of the journalists that fall into that category are enemies of freedom, democracy, and the people.” 

No wonder you are as ill-informed on the charges and evidence against Trump as you are with the Mueller Report. Trump abused power and obstructed congress. He acted to obstruct Mueller’s investigation. Any fair trial would prove these cases. Who knows what insurance and bank fraud he’s committed. What is he hiding in his tax returns? What about Trump Tower Moscow and loans from Russia? Your unquestioning faith in Dear Leader is remarkably cultish.

“…authoritarian Republican state legislators have imposed numerous impediments to discourage voting.” ~ Dubya

Evidence was cited, and obviously ignored. Voter ID is only one front in the Right’s war on democracy by voter suppression.

“But you really don’t care about facts.” Obvious projection, sir. You rarely, if ever, cite evidence. When I do so, you dismiss it.

“You want illegals and felons to vote...”  NO, it is yet another of your false accusations totally unsupported by evidence. See the pattern here? Probably not.

“...since they will expand the leftist big-government Democrats power. That is the real truth.”  NO, it is not. The real truth is I want government of, by and for the people, with fair elections and fair representation. I want equal justice under law. I want my Constitutional rights. I want Constitutional taxation, Constitutional regulation of commerce, and Constitutional provision for the general welfare. I want public education and public healthcare for the general welfare.

You certainly have a real problem with that, and have been indoctrinated to believe that is Marxism.

“You cannot win an honest election so you hope to manipulate it to cheat. THAT is the leftist legacy.”

That’s both dishonest and ludicrous projection. Trump cheated by paying off a porn star. He BROKE THE LAW! And not for the last time.

I’ve seen the Heritage Foundation list. It is mostly election fraud, and committed by both parties. NONE of the Republican voter suppression tactics reduce election fraud.

It disenfranchises tens of thousands of previously registered voters, and prevents only a few dozen acts of voter impersonations. Voter impersonation remains rare and negligible.

Why is it you and Trump call Hillary a criminal, yet NEVER reveal what her “crime” is? Trump’s crimes are clear. He illegally paid off a porn star to cheat in the election. He attempted to obstruct every investigation into his crimes and deals with Russia. He openly solicited a foreign leader’s help in smearing his election opponent. His administration is rampant with corruption. How would a cult ever know about these facts when they believe everything news media say about Trump is “fake news”? He literally can do no wrong, because they reject all information that doesn’t come from the cult leaders and their fawning media.

Hillary did say Biden should be ready to fight if the results come back too close to call. "Joe Biden should not concede under any circumstances because I think this is going to drag out, and eventually I do believe he will win if we don't give an inch and if we are as focused and relentless as the other side is."

Democrats are rightfully sick of losing after getting more votes than Republicans. The slave states’ Electoral College has become an insult and threat to democracy. There’s good reason no other democracy embraces such voter inequality.

In contrast, Trump said that the only way he would lose in November is if the election were rigged. “If Biden Wins, the rioters, anarchists, and arsonists win.”

This is exactly how a fascist would inflate racial fears to undermine democracy.

It is heartening to see many Republicans and former Republicans come out against that man. They also see a tyrant and his cult.

”It is ironic that the man that has done more to help Americans of color is decried as the racist, while Biden who didn’t want desegregation of his kids’ schools to create a “jungle” and has patronized people of color for decades is the left’s champion.”

Bernie, not Biden, is the Left’s champion. Biden is a flawed, moderate, and corporate-friendly politician. And he says stupid stuff. No argument on that.

It is absurdly inaccurate to regurgitate Trump’s boast that he has “done more to help Americans of color”. His party continues to disenfranchise eligible Black voters. This is a proven fact upheld by courts. Just because you choose to ignore the evidence doesn’t mean it’s not so.

You have also ignored the facts from the Bureau of Labor Statistics about Black unemployment rates and job growth in general: 8.1 million jobs were created in the last three years of the Obama administration. 6.6 million jobs were created in the first three years of Trump.

Aug. 2011 the Bush Recession produced a Black unemployment rate 16.7%. January 2017, the black unemployment rate was at 7.8 percent. Under Obama the black unemployment rate dropped 8.9%. Trump crows about a 3.4% drop. The Black president did the heavy lifting and got no credit from the racist Birther or his cult.

“He should have done been better”, is the only response given as the facts are dismissed.

Trump has yet to condemn police brutality. He encouraged it. “Please, don’t be so nice” were his words. He calls Black athletes “sons of bitches” for protesting police brutality. You know I could list many more cases of his racism.

These Republicans are able to see what you cannot:

”Over the course of my career as an undercover officer in the C.I.A., I saw Russian intelligence manipulate many people. I never thought I would see the day when an American president would be one of them. The president’s failure to defend the United States intelligence community’s unanimous conclusions of Russian meddling in the 2016 election and condemn Russian covert counterinfluence campaigns and his standing idle on the world stage while a Russian dictator spouted lies confused many but should concern all Americans. By playing into Vladimir Putin’s hands, the leader of the free world actively participated in a Russian disinformation campaign that legitimized Russian denial and weakened the credibility of the United States to both our friends and foes abroad.” -  Will Hurd, Republican congressman from Texas after Trump’s Helsinki Betrayal

"We're in a strange place. It's becoming a cultish thing, isn't it? It's not a good place for any party to have a cult-like situation as it relates to a President that happens to be purportedly of the same party." - Former Republican Senate Foreign Relations Chairman Bob Corker

The Trump Cult is blind to facts and reason, as you seem to be with everything I’ve said, and to all evidence presented. I am forced to conclude this is done to maintain hate and animosity toward those who disagree. The Right needs to embrace self-righteousness and frame dissent as evil. It is why the Right must spew lies and false accusations to fuel anger, resentment, blame, and hatred. The Right needs to demonize and smear the opposition, dictate terms, and define their own reality. It is why dialogue gets shut down by the Right. They must resort to name calling and false accusations every time. “Snowflake Marxist Pajama Boy”.

This hate and demonization are the reasons why the body count from Right wing terrorism is competing with Jihadist terrorism in our country.

Why can’t you accept that reality? I can’t hate people who fall into a cult. But I WILL call out their indoctrinated delusions, lies, false accusations and blame. I WILL oppose them, and defend truth, decency and democracy. Those are my values they are attacking.

If you are impervious to all of this, and see only lies, false accusations and name calling, then I give up. You will have succeeded in shutting gown dialogue and I will go away. It just proves to me good faith discussion is impossible with the far Right Trump Cult.

Thank you for your patience. I know it isn’t easy to have your beliefs questioned.


U.P. Tim said...

Dave, great read.
Did the Obama/Holder Justice Dept. put in place several consent decrees for cities with police departments that violated civil rights law with police brutality and worse? Amirite! If I remember right, the Justice Dept. run by " Don the Con " and Jeff " Keebler Elf " Sessions came along and tore up those decrees or at least did not enforce them. It is certain that the Justice Dept. under Sessions and the now Cover-up General Bill Barr has been abysmal in regard to prosecuting civil rights violation cases. I think if they have prosecuted any such cases you can count them on one hand. That number may be zero. The lawlessness coming out of this current authoritarian regime continues to expand. Pathetic. We only have one last chance to end it.

Jerry Critter said...

I was encouraged to see our old buddy, Darrell, return to blogging. I was interested to see what the intervening Donald presidency had done to his conservatism. I’m sad to say that it has solidified inline with the Trump Cult and reason, truth, and historic conservative thought have gone by the wayside. As a result, his writings have been returned to the same “file bin” with the likes of most trumpian publications.

Bye bye, Darrell.

Dave Dubya said...

Yes, American justice and democracy have never been in greater danger.

Like every fascist and communist dictator, Trump is abusing the justice system to attack political opposition, and to obstruct investigations of their crimes.

They are by far the most lawless and authoritarian regime in our history.

It's no surprise Darrell would pull a "Lindsay Graham", and abandon his previous opinion that Trump is morally unfit for office. The pattern of the authoritarian personality is to conform, follow their leader, and to demonize, ignore, or shut down all outside opinions and sources of information.

As I've been observing:
Ignorance isn't ignorance to the ignorant.
Racism isn't racism to racists.
A cult isn't a cult to a cult.

Ol' Darrell has gone full-blown Nationalist American Zealot for Inequality.

Substitute "Trump supporter" with "anti-Semite" and Jean-Paul Sartre has defined the Trump Cult:

“Never believe that anti-Semites are completely unaware of the absurdity of their replies. They know that their remarks are frivolous, open to challenge. But they are amusing themselves, for it is their adversary who is obliged to use words responsibly, since he believes in words. The anti-Semites have the right to play. They even like to play with discourse for, by giving ridiculous reasons, they discredit the seriousness of their interlocutors. They delight in acting in bad faith, since they seek not to persuade by sound argument but to intimidate and disconcert. If you press them too closely, they will abruptly fall silent, loftily indicating by some phrase that the time for argument is past.”

U.P. Tim said...

Oh yeah, the old "Lindsay Graham" maneuver from "Donald Trump is a jack ass" to how Graham is today. What a classic. I had a good chuckle with that one. It really sounds like Jaime Harrison is within striking distance and could take Graham out. I'm thinking that it's looking better everyday and a takeover of the Senate could occur. Many of the Republicons are running behind in the polling to their Democratic opponent. I do know it's only polling however.

Dave Dubya said...

Our optimism should be on the cautious side. They cheat. They lie. They steal. Their war on democracy will not end until they get their one-party dictatorship. Democracy has been on the losing end too much lately. If not for the turnover in the House, who knows how much farther into fascism we would be.

Just the Facts! said...

To stop Trump from cheating will you support me in demanding voter ID and support Tulsi Gabbard's bill (who got more votes for the democrat nomination for president than Kamala Harris) H.R.8285, a House bill called the Election Fraud Prevention Act?

Dave Dubya said...

LOL. Thanks for the joke. Let's see what's in the bill.

TB3 said...

Boy, Ballot Harvesting sure sounds sinister, doesn't it? And to frame it as something that'd stop Trump from cheating. Boy howdy. The "conservative" love affair with Tulsi is interesting. Also the weird slam dunk JTF thinks he's made (or, let's face it, where ever he cuts and pastes that little factoid from) is an odd one. Of course Tulsi got more votes. She actually stayed in the Primary. Harris dropped out before voting started, so... yeah? What a weird flex.

Also the weird, anti-democratic mindset so many "conservatives" are nakedly expressing about the very act of voting. Darrell in his T.Paine days railed and railed and cried and cried about our Dictator President doing Dictatory things and disregards for the norms of our democratic society and the Constitution and yadda yadda yadda. It's simultaneously mind boggling and mind numbing the arguments these same types of people make in 2020 with the guy legit doing the things they projected onto the previous President.

Dave Dubya said...

Poor Darrell isn't up to engaging my points. I mean beyond deflections, projections and groundless assertions and accusations.

He's posting a small fraction of my comments about my own poem at his blog. Guess who gets accused of "cancel culture"?

He particularly dreads and avoids any discussion of Flynn and Stone swearing an oath to QAnon and flashing the white power hand sign with Proud Boys.

I wonder why....

TB3 said...

It's only "cancel culture" when it's something like or something they decided they liked when it got cancelled. Oh, the videos of 'this is totally not cancel culture' of "conservatives" lighting sneakers on fire or throwing coffee machines off of balconies or attitude toward Goodyear or the attitude toward practitioners of a certain gesture during a certain national anthem or what happened with Bill Maher or the Dixie Chicks or any of the myriad instances that demonstrates "conservative" hypocrisy and hate mongering.

But, whatever. Let's dutifully get distracted over "cancel culture" while actual threats to our Democracy are being suggested and perpetrated. "Jokes" of '12 more years' and 'Lock Her Up' and 'Third term' and 'fake news' and 'hoax investigation' and 'fraudulent election' all while our President is floating the idea that Republican-run States should defy the will of their populations and vote for Trump Electors anyway? That shit's not funny and it's frustrating that the JTFs and Darrell's of the world turn a blind eye toward that but direct so much time and energy talking about how known stutterer Joe Biden stutters occasionally and totally indicates he's got one foot in the grave and mentally ill.

It's frustrating that such a large minority of my fellow citizens are so stupid and tribal that they delude themselves in this way. And it is self delusion, because they rather be deluded than be wrong. Unfortunately for them, just because they deny being wrong, it doesn't mean they're not. They are.

So stupid.

Dave Dubya said...

I have to finally admit it. Conservatives are obviously brighter than me. They know it’s safe to go to large gatherings and Trump rallies without wearing masks. Them dumb Libs sure are the stupid ones, amirite?

Herman Cain and this guy agree.

A TRUMP-supporting politician who said coronavirus was a "socialist" hoax has been killed by the disease.

TB3 said...

"Conservatives are obviously brighter than me"

I'd be careful repeating that, lest you gain additional "conservative" ire for stealing the chip off of their shoulder. Remember, they're the ones with disdain for intellectualism. Though, to be honest, if they perceive that to be taken from them as well... they'll just blame minorities or poor people or poor minorities.

Darrell Michaels said...

"I'd be careful repeating that, lest you gain additional "conservative" ire for stealing the chip off of their shoulder. Remember, they're the ones with disdain for intellectualism. Though, to be honest, if they perceive that to be taken from them as well... they'll just blame minorities or poor people or poor minorities." ~ TB3

TB3, don't go down the rabbit hole after Dave. I expect better from you, sir.

TB3 said...

Oh, it's just a joke, Darrell.

It's just a joke. It's sarcasm. I'm not being serious.

This is how our President is defended when he makes outlandish statements like 12 more years or noted, practicing Catholic Joe Biden will hurt God. Except the difference between the President and I? My comment was actually intended to be a joke. You expect better and I want to encourage and receive better in political discourse. The difference between me and politicians of all stripes, I'll apologize.

I'm sorry. I was insensitive.

Dave Dubya said...

TB3, and Darrell,

Of course it was a joke. I am much brighter than Trump voters. That's why I don't vote for him. ;-)

This part wasn't a joke, unless perhaps on the fool who called the virus a "socialist hoax".

"A TRUMP-supporting politician who said coronavirus was a "socialist" hoax has been killed by the disease."

I wonder if Darrell sees a connection between that man's death and Trump downplaying the virus, and scaring people with phantoms of socialism, whatever that is in their fevered minds.

The poor man's sad fate inspired me to write my next piece, though.

Trumpism FEELS good, until it doesn't.